Ending WEP and GPO means $, $$, or $$$ to millions of retired or retiring state and local workers. It also represents a major incentive to work part career in non-covered employment.
Hi Bruce, We've updated both MaxiFi and Maximize My Social Security to eliminate the WEP and GPO from our SS calculations. We are in the process of eliminating the questions about non-covered pensions and non-covered retirement accounts. best, Larry
Don, Yes, yes, yes. The whole system needs to be retired with everyone receiving, over time, what they accrued to date. See my 10-bullet plan in You're Hired -- a free download book at kotlikoff.net. best, Larry
Brad, This is why I suggest "The Unfairness Act" is the right title. It's not my doing, pls bear that in mind. I would have pushed very different legislation. best, Larry
Let me see if I’ve got this right. I worked for 54 years paying into the Social Security system religiously year after year. My buddy worked 10 years in low paying fast food jobs from 1970 to 1980. He then spent the next 40 years in non-covered employment in state and federal employment.
Now, I and my wife have to survive on straight Social Security and income from our investments that we scrimped and saved and sacrificed to invest in while my buddy drove around in Cadillacs? And took nice vacations? With greater benefits that either I or my wife could obtain? And yet my buddy gets to double dip for the rest of his life, collecting much more money than his measly 10 years of payment into the system in the 70s would ever provide him in his wildest dreams?
And people and politicians of this country scream about government welfare as a $35 trillion national deficit that grows at 2 trillion a year and forces me to cut back on my Social Security investments by upwards of 25% by 2035 because there’s not enough money being paid into the system?
And yet everybody wants to sell software so that one can determine how greedy they can be? I’d like to hear an article on social equity in regards to this outrageous and blatant political act by the powers that be that screams "Just let big Brother take care of me".
Hell, why doesn't everyone just go to work for the federal or state governments? To hell with sacrifice? Everybody to the pig trough like we did and continue to do with the COVID gimme?
Just let big Brother take care of us until the national debt interest alone will choke us all
I was thinking the same thing. This means that those who pay into socially security are literally subsidizing those who don't. Nothing about that seems fair.
Yeah, and I noticed how Larry parsed his words and kinda danced around the ethical and moral aspects of this blatant hand out to get elected and stay elected.
In 2023, around 19.58 million people were working for state and local governments in the United States. This is much higher than the number of federal government (civilian) employees, which stood at about 2.87 million people in that year. 174 million were working. So 13% of the entire working population gets free unfunded money they did not earn. I am sure everyone of those folks will vote for re-election of every politician that voted for it. 20 plus million people can get you elected many times. Just more bread for Plebeians. The Circuses are already here and the Senatorial class is once again manipulating the hoi polloi
The repeal of WEP/GPO will affect our SS projections. Your post mentions updating MMSS and Maxifi to reflect the repeal. How will we know when they are updated and what changes we need to make in our profiles? Will we need to reimport any data from socialsecurity.gov? Or reimport our MMSS file into Maxifi?
Still part of the problem. Too much money, in too few hands, with too much power, over too many people.......with little to no regards to the immediate and long-term consequences for average Americans......
No matter your feelings on this - just wait for what is coming next. The Billionaire Blood Suckers........are going to try and take it all from everyone..........and stuff their pockets with our money........
Must be nice....they also get to contribute to a 403b AND 457.....along with a pension with COLA. And people wonder why Fairfax, Montgomery and Loudon counties are so wealthy.....wealthier than Silicon Valley and the Permian Basin.
C'mon, Larry, we all know this was just a blatant, politically driven hand-out to government workers unions, and for the most part, will be a windfall for those workers and be disadvantageous to those who paid SS taxes for their whole careers, including some of us who paid in for far beyond the 35 years they figure the benefits on. Where's our windfall for all those taxes paid without benefits? I share your disgust with the clawback problem (seems unfair if the government made the mistake), but the logic behind the WEP was fairness; that's right, fairness for all of us who ONLY get Social Security, and not a fat government pension, and therefore get a very small percentage benefit back.
Even all that aside, what does this say about what our representatives can or will do about saving the impending doom of SS finances, if they can't even stand up to disgruntled government pensioners who incorrectly thought they were being done wrong??
Hi Larry, I was affected by the WEP but the reduction in SS benefit was way more than half. I was a pastor for 5 years in Canada in the 1990's and paid into their system (Canada Pension). I am now retired. I get (presently) 125 dollars a month from Canada Pension. (It depends on the exchange rate —a half year ago it was 132). I have not yet claimed SS (I am waiting to 70) but both MaxiFiPlanner and the SS WEP calculator show my final benefit being reduced for the year 1212 (this is 101 a month). In what universe is 101 half of 130 (the amount of the benefit at the time when using the calculator). For 5 years of labor I was granted by SS + Canada Pension only 28 dollars a month because of WEP!! I believe it has to do with how the WEP is applied. They use half your present non covered pension and subtract it from a PIA calculated at age 62 (8 years before you claim SS) so your non covered pension is reduced not by half but but much more because the increase of benefit of waiting 8 years and the colas of 8 years start with a smaller amount so poof your entire non covered pension disappears. I understand that it is not entirely fair to repeal the WEP but the way it was applied was also unfair and clearly no one was going to fix it without the drastic step of simply repealing it. PS isn't there a simpler way in MaxiFi to calculate the new SS benefit amount without WEP? Simply check the proper box that asks if this pension is covered or non covered by SS?
Hi Bruce, We've updated both MaxiFi and Maximize My Social Security to eliminate the WEP and GPO from our SS calculations. We are in the process of eliminating the questions about non-covered pensions and non-covered retirement accounts. best, Larry
Well, this isn't lining Elon's pocket. best, Larry
Yup!
Don, Yes, yes, yes. The whole system needs to be retired with everyone receiving, over time, what they accrued to date. See my 10-bullet plan in You're Hired -- a free download book at kotlikoff.net. best, Larry
Brad, This is why I suggest "The Unfairness Act" is the right title. It's not my doing, pls bear that in mind. I would have pushed very different legislation. best, Larry
Let me see if I’ve got this right. I worked for 54 years paying into the Social Security system religiously year after year. My buddy worked 10 years in low paying fast food jobs from 1970 to 1980. He then spent the next 40 years in non-covered employment in state and federal employment.
Now, I and my wife have to survive on straight Social Security and income from our investments that we scrimped and saved and sacrificed to invest in while my buddy drove around in Cadillacs? And took nice vacations? With greater benefits that either I or my wife could obtain? And yet my buddy gets to double dip for the rest of his life, collecting much more money than his measly 10 years of payment into the system in the 70s would ever provide him in his wildest dreams?
And people and politicians of this country scream about government welfare as a $35 trillion national deficit that grows at 2 trillion a year and forces me to cut back on my Social Security investments by upwards of 25% by 2035 because there’s not enough money being paid into the system?
And yet everybody wants to sell software so that one can determine how greedy they can be? I’d like to hear an article on social equity in regards to this outrageous and blatant political act by the powers that be that screams "Just let big Brother take care of me".
Hell, why doesn't everyone just go to work for the federal or state governments? To hell with sacrifice? Everybody to the pig trough like we did and continue to do with the COVID gimme?
Just let big Brother take care of us until the national debt interest alone will choke us all
I was thinking the same thing. This means that those who pay into socially security are literally subsidizing those who don't. Nothing about that seems fair.
Yeah, and I noticed how Larry parsed his words and kinda danced around the ethical and moral aspects of this blatant hand out to get elected and stay elected.
In 2023, around 19.58 million people were working for state and local governments in the United States. This is much higher than the number of federal government (civilian) employees, which stood at about 2.87 million people in that year. 174 million were working. So 13% of the entire working population gets free unfunded money they did not earn. I am sure everyone of those folks will vote for re-election of every politician that voted for it. 20 plus million people can get you elected many times. Just more bread for Plebeians. The Circuses are already here and the Senatorial class is once again manipulating the hoi polloi
The repeal of WEP/GPO will affect our SS projections. Your post mentions updating MMSS and Maxifi to reflect the repeal. How will we know when they are updated and what changes we need to make in our profiles? Will we need to reimport any data from socialsecurity.gov? Or reimport our MMSS file into Maxifi?
Still part of the problem. Too much money, in too few hands, with too much power, over too many people.......with little to no regards to the immediate and long-term consequences for average Americans......
No matter your feelings on this - just wait for what is coming next. The Billionaire Blood Suckers........are going to try and take it all from everyone..........and stuff their pockets with our money........
Not billionaire.....millionaire, as I believe no congressperson is a billionaire yet.
Must be nice....they also get to contribute to a 403b AND 457.....along with a pension with COLA. And people wonder why Fairfax, Montgomery and Loudon counties are so wealthy.....wealthier than Silicon Valley and the Permian Basin.
C'mon, Larry, we all know this was just a blatant, politically driven hand-out to government workers unions, and for the most part, will be a windfall for those workers and be disadvantageous to those who paid SS taxes for their whole careers, including some of us who paid in for far beyond the 35 years they figure the benefits on. Where's our windfall for all those taxes paid without benefits? I share your disgust with the clawback problem (seems unfair if the government made the mistake), but the logic behind the WEP was fairness; that's right, fairness for all of us who ONLY get Social Security, and not a fat government pension, and therefore get a very small percentage benefit back.
Even all that aside, what does this say about what our representatives can or will do about saving the impending doom of SS finances, if they can't even stand up to disgruntled government pensioners who incorrectly thought they were being done wrong??
Hi Larry, I was affected by the WEP but the reduction in SS benefit was way more than half. I was a pastor for 5 years in Canada in the 1990's and paid into their system (Canada Pension). I am now retired. I get (presently) 125 dollars a month from Canada Pension. (It depends on the exchange rate —a half year ago it was 132). I have not yet claimed SS (I am waiting to 70) but both MaxiFiPlanner and the SS WEP calculator show my final benefit being reduced for the year 1212 (this is 101 a month). In what universe is 101 half of 130 (the amount of the benefit at the time when using the calculator). For 5 years of labor I was granted by SS + Canada Pension only 28 dollars a month because of WEP!! I believe it has to do with how the WEP is applied. They use half your present non covered pension and subtract it from a PIA calculated at age 62 (8 years before you claim SS) so your non covered pension is reduced not by half but but much more because the increase of benefit of waiting 8 years and the colas of 8 years start with a smaller amount so poof your entire non covered pension disappears. I understand that it is not entirely fair to repeal the WEP but the way it was applied was also unfair and clearly no one was going to fix it without the drastic step of simply repealing it. PS isn't there a simpler way in MaxiFi to calculate the new SS benefit amount without WEP? Simply check the proper box that asks if this pension is covered or non covered by SS?